53297 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/03/2000 
7:58:29 PM 10/27/2000 4:00:05 AM -1 112 0 "Shannon and 
Beej-



I'm only 60 pages or so into it, but am enjoying LM.  I was 
surprised to find several instances of humor in the first few 
pages.  One occurred when describing the bishop's policy of 
kindness and generosity to all people.  ""Clearly, he had his 
own strange way of judging things.  I suspect he acquired it 
from the Gospels.""



Another surprise is the social commentary on the death 
penalty.  After the execution at the guillotine, his sister 
overhears him, ""I didn't believe it could be so monstrous.  
It's wrong to be so absorbed in divine law as not to perceive 
human law.  Death belongs to God alone.  By what right to 
men touch that unknown thing?""  The argument is still being 
heard today.



I also liked his comment on human nature: ""Have no fear of 
robbers or murderers.  They are external dangers, petty 
dangers.  We should fear ourselves.  Prejudices are the real 
robbers; vices the real murderers.  The great dangers are 
within us.  Why worry about what threatens our heads or our 
purses?  Let us think instead of what threatens our 
souls.""



And continuing along that line, and applicable to current day 
mores in the US:  ""...To destroy abuses is not enough; 
habits must also be changed.  The windmill has gone, but 
the wind is still there.""  And therein lies the problem with 
race relations, and ethnic cleansing.



Question:  What is the purpose of M. Myriel's conversation 
with the revolutionist?  Is it to set up acceptance for the story 
that follows?  Or to expand the bishop's political 
philosophy?



Hugo paints the picture of a saint, who eventually must fall, 
I'd imagine.  I'll get to that part tomorrow.



Who wrote the Bishop and the Candlesticks short story?  I 
remember reading it in jr. high.



 


 


"
53329 11 65 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/04/2000 
3:16:50 AM 10/27/2000 4:00:06 AM -1 95 0 "Kay -- I also 
noted the humor running through the writing here and the 
ties to political/moral issues which continue to haunt 
humanity and societies.



I am unclear what conversation with the revolutionist you are 
referring to in your question, however, so can't respond.  I'm 
curious about it though so please help me locate the 
passage with this conversation.



As for that short piece -- I remember reading that also -- is it 
possible that it was attributed to someone as having been 
based upon Les Miserables?  I certainly don't recall.  And I 
had some vague idea that it was a play as opposed to a 
short story.



I am at Chapter VII of Book Two -- The Fall in Fantine.  I am 
not moving very rapidly here it seems.



I had marked the passage beginning with ""To be a saint is 
the exception; to be upright is the rule.  Err, falter, sin, but 
be upright. ... and ending with the delightful line you quoted 
...Clearly he had his own strange way of judging things.  I 
suspect he acquired it from the Gospels.""  The whole 
section is slyly humorous prodding at the society of the  
times and yet timeless in that it addresses the balance of 
good/evil and approaches to the problems arising from the 
ongoing struggles of humanity.



I had also marked the passages you quote on the death 
penalty and the human nature  and threats to the soul.  Are 
you sure you aren't reading over my shoulder?



Dottie

ID is an oxymoron!


"
53338 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/04/2000 
7:35:20 AM 10/27/2000 4:00:06 AM -1 97 0 "Dottie-



Great minds think alike, that's all.  :-)



The passage with the revolutionary comes when Bishop 
Bienvenu goes to visit the dying recluse at the end of 
Chapter X ""The Bishop in the Presence of an Unfamiliar 
Light.""



I was curious about the arrest of the pope mentioned in 
chapter 10, ""The Qualification.""  From what I can gather, 
Napoleon had been feuding with the Holy See for many 
years, and when Pius VII refused to support Napoleon's 
campaigns or recognize the Emperor as supreme 
commander, Napoleon got fed up and had the pope 
arrested.  For a more specific history, try : http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/10687a.htm



Then scroll to: The Great Victories; Occupation of Rome; 
Imprisonment of Pius VII (1805-09). 



Off to my in person book group, followed by ""The Fall.""  I'll 
catch up to you, Beej, and Shannon one of these days.



 


 


"
53353 11 65 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/04/2000 
9:03:18 AM 10/27/2000 4:00:06 AM -1 106 0 "Kay -- 
Thanks!  Found both of those and thanks for the 
website.



I AM reading today and getting into a better pace -- but 
doubt I'll catch up after such a slow start.  I think we should 
compare notes on divisions within the three different 
versions we have in hand just to get our bearings a bit.  Kay, 
refresh my memory on the edition/publisher of your copy?  
Mine is the Signet Classic and says on the cover 'The only 
complete and unabridged paperback edition.' 



Beej and Shannon -- where are you by now?  How many 
divisions or chapters appear in the abridged version 
Shannon has and what is the edition/publisher of it?



Dottie

ID is an oxymoron!


"
53387 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/04/2000 
1:38:25 PM 10/27/2000 4:00:06 AM -1 98 0 "Dottie-



I have the same edition as you.



 


 


"
53396 11 65 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/04/2000 
2:02:12 PM 10/27/2000 4:00:06 AM -1 99 0 "Thanks for 
clarifying, Kay -- so Beej's is the 1100 plus pp. and we don't 
know -- or do we -- which edition is the abridged one 
Shannon is using.  I am really getting into LM and don't want 
to put it down but DID cook and eat dinner to keep up my 
strength for reading {G}.



Dottie

ID is an oxymoron!


"
53402 11 555 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/04/2000 
2:17:58 PM 10/27/2000 4:00:06 AM -1 106 0 "Kay and 
Dottie, I am in ""Cossette"", Book Third, Chapter VIII.

I have a hard cover version, actually put out by Barnes and 
Nobles by arrangement with Random House, Inc., 1222 
pages, but no intro. 

Shannon has an abridged version, 400 pages, published by 
The Consumer Publishing Division of CBS Inc., with an intro 
by James K. Robinson from the University of Cincinnati.




Beej


"
53577 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/06/2000 
11:09:21 AM 10/28/2000 4:00:06 AM -1 103 0 "Just starting 
""Cosette"" Book 1.  



Victor Hugo's mother was a royalist and his father followed 
whomever was in power at the time.  There was a lot of 
political dissension in the Hugo household, which is reflected 
in Les Misearables.  That must have been difficult for a small 
child to deal with.  Perhaps that's one reason why the sense 
of turmoil is so vivid in the story.



I think it's interesting that the author makes a point of 
speaking directly to the reader.  He has a number of asides, 
as if sitting in a tavern, telling the tale.  Then, I came upon 
the start of ""Cosette,"" - Waterloo, and he's telling the 
history of his family's home.  Does anyone know how much 
of that reflects the actual Hugo family tree?



I thought Jean Valjean's wrestle with his fate and his 
conscience was realistic.  Up to then, his and the bishop's 
goodness were becoming a tad trying.  But then, that's part 
of the nature of Romantic writing.  



I particularly liked the ""well, this must mean that God 
doesn't want me to declare myself as Jean Valjean"" 
discourse.  Yet, all the while, he was moving toward doing 
the right thing, even while not being sure that's what he 
wanted to do.  I've been in similar situations, and I think that 
method of dealing with a personal crisis is quite accurate.  
We move forward towards a goal, debating the pros and 
cons all the way.  



Wasn't Tholomyes' ""surprise"" cruel and arrogant?  Was 
Hugo being sarcastic in his chapter, ""The Wisdom of 
Tholomyes?""  I thought he was making fun of the wealthy 
do-nothings and their general mediocrity.  He later says that 
they become the middlemen - ""...prefects, fathers of 
families, country policemen, and councilors of state.  
Venerate us.  We are sacrificing ourselves.  Mourn us 
quickly, replace us rapidly..."" (Fantine, Book Three, 
Chapter IX, ""Joyful End of Joy"")



I love the continual comments on the nature of politics and 
politicians.  :-)



Hugo's take on the sanctimoniously good Javert is right on:  
""...He raised his head with an expression of sovereign 
authority, an expression always that much more frightening 
when power is vested in lower beings - ferocious in the wild 
beast, vicious in the undeveloped man.""  (Fantine, Book 5, 
Chapter XIII, ""Solution of Some Questions of the Municipal 
Police""  



Javert's veneration of authority is beautifully portrayed by 
Hugo.  ""Probity, sincerity, candor, conviction, the idea of 
duty, are things that, when in error, can turn hideous, but - 
even though hideous - remain great; their majesty, peculiar 
to the human conscience, persists in horror.  They are 
virtues with a single vice - error.  The pitiless, sincere joy of 
a fanatic in an act of atrocity preserves some mournful 
radiance that inspires veneration.  Without suspecting it, 
Javert, in his dreadful happiness, was pitiful, like every 
ignorant man in triumph.  Nothing could be more 
poignant and terrible than this face, which revealed what 
might be called all the evil of good.""  Emphasis is 
mine. (Fantine, Book 8, Chapter III ""Javert Satisfied"")



Whew!  I've known a lot of people like that.



And then his comments on nosy, self-appointed keepers of 
the town morality:  ""For prying into other people's affairs, 
none are equal to those of whom it is no concern......There 
are those who, to solve one of these enigmas, which are 
completely irrelevant to them, spend more money, waste 
more time, and give themselves more trouble than ten good 
deeds would take - and they do it for the pleasure of it, 
without being paid for their curiosity in any other way than 
with more curiosity."" (Fantine, Book 5, Chapter 8 ""Madame 
Victurnien Spends Thirty-Five Francs on Morality"" 



Does that sound like any politicians you know that get in an 
uproar about purple Tele-Tubby babies?  :-)



I especially liked the description of Mme. Thenardier:  ""This 
Madame Thenardier was a red-headed, large but angular 
woman, the soldier's wife type in all its horror, with, strangely 
enough, a languid air gained from novel reading.  She was 
unrefined but simpering.  Old romances impressed on the 
imaginations of mistresses or restaurants have such 
effects.""  :-) (Fantine, Book Four, Chapter II ""First Sketch 
of Two Equivocal Faces"")  :-)



And her hubby - ""...a genuine villain, a ruffian, educated 
almost to the point of grammar, at once coarse and fine, but 
so far as sentimentality was concerned, reading Pigault 
Lebrun, and for ""all related to the weaker sex,' as he put it, 
a totally correct dolt.""  Ha! (Fantine, Book Four, Chapter II 
""First Sketch of Two Equivocal Faces"")





But oh, how Hugo can weave a sense of blackness when 
describing their souls:  ""They were among those dwarfish 
natures, which, if they happen to be heated by some sullen 
fire, easily become monstrous.  The woman was at heart a 
brute, the man a blackguard, both in the highest degree 
capable of that hideous sort of progression that can be 
made toward evil.  There are souls that, crablike,  crawl 
continually toward darkness, going backward in life rather 
than advancing, using their experience to increase their 
deformity, growing continually worse, and becoming steeped 
more and more thoroughly in an intensifying viciousness.  
That was the case with this man and this woman."" - Fantine, 
Book Four, Chapter II ""First Sketch of Two Equivocal 
Faces""







 


 


"
53582 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/06/2000 
11:25:50 AM 10/28/2000 4:00:06 AM -1 103 0 
"Shannon-



Where are you in your reading?  What are you enjoying the 
most so far?  Are there any parts/characters that have 
struck you?  Anything that has bothered you?  I'm just 
throwing out some questions because I'm curious about your 
take on LM.



Great story, isn't it?



 


 


"
53583 11 65 53584 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 
10/06/2000 11:30:11 AM 10/28/2000 4:00:06 AM -1 105 0 
"Kay -- Hugo certainly can wrap the reader right into the 
story with his detailed writing.  Many of the passage you 
quote are perfect examples of the whole of this thus far.  I 
am finding that I surprisingly recall the details of many of 
these incidents quite well and finding that those sections 
which I have NOT encountered previously are adding so 
much to my enjoyment of reacquaintance with the story.  I 
am almost to the Cosette section and reading pell-mell!  
Particularly through that great internal debate and the mad 
journey to attend the trial of the counterfeit Jean ValJean.  I 
left off, in fact, just as he had used his name as M. -- the 
Mayor to gain one of the seats behind the judge.  This book 
gets one's adrenalin flowing -- suspense, compassion, 
fear.



Dottie -- thoroughly enjoying Les Mis in full

ID is an oxymoron!


"
53584 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/06/2000 
11:46:29 AM 10/28/2000 4:00:06 AM -1 105 0 "Here are 
some pics and information about the Battle of Hougomont 
during Waterloo:



http://members.home.net/empirebks/galhoug.html



http://www.expatriate-online.com/travel/cities/brussels/hougomont.html



 


 


"
53596 11 65 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/06/2000 
1:00:34 PM 10/28/2000 4:00:06 AM -1 102 0 "Kay -- will 
explore these websites more but want to say that when Jim 
returns from his business trip I'll see if I can import some 
scanned photos from our visit to Waterloo last Nov 12th -- It 
was BITTER windy cold that day but we climbed the rather 
unstable looking scaffolding stairway to the lion and took 
photos from the platform surrounding it.  The most 
impressive thing to me there was the video shown in the 
museum and the panoramic painting housed in the round 
building which has a name that I have lost momentarily.  We 
are going back to visit the farms and buildings associated 
with the battle before too long.



And I had already done a little mental skip in anticipation of 
reading that Waterloo section in Cosette.  



Dottie

ID is an oxymoron!


"
53605 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/06/2000 
2:58:03 PM 10/28/2000 4:00:07 AM -1 101 0 "Dottie-



I'm looking forward to those pics.  The battle scene is so 
vividly described, isn't it?  Though I have to confess, I 
skipped the parts of who was where, to get to the parts I 
cared about.  Wasn't that chasm filled with soldiers and 
horses just awful?



What is this ""lion"" Hugo keeps referring to?  The picture 
didn't clear it up, but then, I'm on my work computer, and it 
doesn't do colors very well.



Is the well where the bodies were thrown still there?



 


 


"
53606 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/06/2000 
3:01:23 PM 10/28/2000 4:00:07 AM -1 106 0 "Question:  In 
Cosette, Book Three, Chapter XI, ""Number 9430 Comes Up 
Again, and Cosette Draws it"" Hugo says that at Cap Brun, 
Jean Valjean ""did not lack for money.""  Did I miss 
something?  I can't assume he had cash on him when he 
""fell"" from the ship after rescuing the sailor.  He couldn't 
have earned it without showing a passport, and I don't think 
he'd rob anyone at that point.  At least, not that Hugo would 
let us know.  

:-)

 


 


"
53607 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/06/2000 
3:06:06 PM 10/28/2000 4:00:07 AM -1 101 0 "Oh, me too, 
Dottie.  Wait til you get to the part where you meet Cosette 
at the Thenardiers' inn.  I wanted to weep for this child.  I 
think Hugo must have known something of that kind of fear 
and suppression.  But maybe not, as he has so accurately 
portrayed so many others.  He has one phenomenal ability 
of observation of human nature.



Part of my enjoyment is coming from having seen the stage 
performance of Les Mis.  This fills in so many gaps.  Next 
time I see it, I'll appreciate the doll being given to Cosette 
even more than I did the first two times.  Wow!



 


 


"
53685 11 555 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/07/2000 
3:16:36 PM 10/29/2000 4:00:02 AM -1 93 0 "Dottie and Kay, 
I'm in Marius, Book First, Chapter VI. Have either of you 
started to read of the convent and the cloistered nuns? Let 
me know when you get there. I really want to discuss this 
part with you!

Shannon has had tons of homework, and a school dance, 
and though she's plugging along and seems to enjoy it, she 
hasn't gotten deeply into LES MISERABLES yet. But she 
will.

(It sure is hard to put this book aside, isn't it!!)



Beej


"
53686 11 65 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/07/2000 
3:24:43 PM 10/29/2000 4:00:02 AM -1 96 0 "Beej -- you are 
racing away from me -- I didn't read any of this today -- have 
been busy with -- yuck -- housework and have just jumped 
on and off the board and doodled around the internet and 
such sporadically to take breaks.  I have been making the 
most progress reading at bedtime -- Jim isn't here to say -- 
""are you going to turn out the light and go to bed soon?"" -- 
while the cat's away and all that.  I'm just beginning Cosette.  
Will certainly notify you when I hit the convent stuff.



Dottie -- who agrees it isn't easy to leave this one lying 
waiting -- as I have had to do all day today!

ID is an oxymoron!


"
53689 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/07/2000 
4:28:23 PM 10/29/2000 4:00:02 AM -1 91 0 "No, I haven't 
reached the nuns in their cloister yet, but you sure have me 
intrigued.  I'm just at the point that Jean Valjean is walking 
away with Cosette.



I cannot imagine trying to read this with all of high school 
going on.  Tell Shannon we'll wait on her.  :-)



 


 


"
53691 11 555 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/07/2000 
4:35:29 PM 10/29/2000 4:00:02 AM -1 96 0 "Kay, Actually 
Shannon is just in middle school, but she is anxious to get 
on here and tell her impressions of the book. 

Doesn't the Thenardier's treatment of Cosette just break 
your heart? Sort of like Cinderella isn't it?

I loved this sentence in an earlier part of the book:



""There is one spectacle grander than the sea, that is the 
sky; there is one spectacle grander than the sky, that is the 
interior of the soul.""



Beej


"
53705 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/07/2000 
7:45:55 PM 10/29/2000 4:00:02 AM -1 87 0 "Yes, the 
Thenardiers are awful people.  And I had to wonder at the 
townspeople that knew what was going on and did nothing.  
Of course, that was a different age.  



 


 


"
53716 11 65 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/08/2000 
4:56:17 AM 10/30/2000 4:00:03 AM -1 105 0 "Kay and Beej 
-- yes, the sea, sky and soul line touched a chord in me as 
well -- as for the Thenardiers and their greedy and 
treachery and mistreatment of Cosette (and though, 
supposedly they used her money for their own children -- I 
think they didn't do any better for their own) -- think the 
squalor of any society in any era where dire poverty and the 
upheaval of revolutions are in process.  



This is how it plays out, this is how it played out in the past -- 
and IMO -- this is how it will continue to play out in the 
future.  Though now we have aid in many forms and from 
many quarter I think there were also people who did offer aid 
and systems to do what they could for these situations  -- it's 
just never enough or never the right approach to end the 
cycle or maybe it's that new cycles develop.



I am in the midst of Waterloo and thoroughly enjoying it 
because as I read, I am picturing these things but also 
getting tingles as I read Hugo's aside to the reader sections 
of his footsteps going where I went in November.  Every now 
and then this treading on old ground does that to a person 
and reading and remembering  together just gave me a 
shiver.


 
I mentioned I would scan and post pictures when Jim is back 
(he has everything hooked up to his computer at the 
moment and I am not going to try to switch things as I would 
like to continue having access to my e-mail and CR for the 
next few days -- he-he).  I was speaking of Waterloo pictures 
earlier but also have lots and lots of photos of the Villiers 
Abby mentioned in the Waterloo section (it is now only a 
ruins but extensive and lovely and is on my personal list to 
go back for an entire day to explore it further).



Dottie -- who will be reading Les Mis and doing housework 
on my breaks today -- after all it is Sunday here now! 



ID is an oxymoron!


"
53720 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/08/2000 
7:08:19 AM 10/30/2000 4:00:03 AM -1 101 0 "Dottie-



You're so right about the cycle of poverty and the plight of 
its children.  Thank goodness for writers like Hugo that force 
our consciences to question that cycle and to do what we 
can, where we can.



Your comment on viewing Waterloo and Villiers Abbey with 
Hugo was an intriguing one.  When I travel, I like to stand 
quietly and let the history seep into my being.  Hmmmm - 
you accepting visitors any time soon?  :-)



I took yesterday off from Les Miserables, in order to get 
some house work done.  But today, after working the 
Sunday NYT puzzle, I plan to resume my trek with Cosette 
and Jean.  How I'll also get my reading done for my in 
person group is a mystery.  It's all in the reading gods' 
hands.



Isn't there an axiom along the lines of, ""Time expands to 
encompass all necessary reading?""



 


 


"
53726 11 65 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/08/2000 
9:03:59 AM 10/30/2000 4:00:03 AM -1 103 0 "Kay -- we 
have room for four people and are here indefinitely --  is 
your passport in order?  



I have felt this haunting of history in more than one spot we 
have visited but perhaps the most personal one was in 
Mainz where I came to grips with the idea that my ancestor, 
born in Mainz and found living ca.1700's in New Jersey had 
likely stood before that cathedral in Mainz, had perhaps  
trod the very lanes of the old town that I was walking at some 
point before he set out for America in the early days of the 
Revolution which gave us The United States of America.  I 
think but have no proof that he was among the hired 
German military which switched sides against the British and 
stayed to marry and enjoy his freedom and raising his family 
in a new land. 



I have just finished Book One Waterloo, in Cosette and must 
say that the description was awesome and beautiful and 
dreadful.   I will also add that it is PERFECT for bringing the 
panoramic painting before the mind's eye once again!  I 
have gone to the tour book and it states the rotunda 
housing this was built in 1912 at the foot of the mound -- the 
panoramic painting is 110m/360ft in circumference and 
12m/39ft high and was created by French painter Dumoulin 
and five other artists.  It represents a few of the most striking 
episodes in the battle at the moment when Ney sent his 
cavalry along the ""sunken path"".  



So the descriptions of that vortex of battle in Hugo's 
wonderfully flowing language is a description of exactly the 
scenes depicted here in this panorama -- which besides the 
huge painting includes tableaux with wax and cast figures 
and props and all arranged around the base of the 
painting.  Upon entering the rotunda one goes up a flight of 
stairs and arrives in a loft which places one at the upper 
third of the painting and so as one walks around the circle 
the battle is viewed almost as though from the air or some 
lookout placed magically within the eye of the storm -- it is 
truly an amazing work.



Another aside -- the Duchess of Richmond's ball that Hugo 
mentions is also noted in the tour book.  Wellington was in 
attendance and received the letter saying Napoleon was 
only 14 miles from Brussels -- supposedly within 20 minutes 
the ballroom had emptied.  



This ball is also mentioned at a site in the center of 
Bastogne in reference to the fact that the evening before 
the arrival there and the demand to General McAuliffe from 
the German General von Manteuffel for surrender (to 
which          McAuliffe sent his famous reply ""Nuts!"") the 
American troops at Bastogne had indeed been 
honored/entertained  at a large ball!  Bastogne is the 
deciding point of the famous Battle of the Bulge of course.  
Not only this connection to the ball on the eve of the battle 
but also other comparisons with Waterloo were made in the 
display there but the other details are lost in my head 
somewhere.



Dottie

ID is an oxymoron!


"
53744 11 528 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/08/2000 
11:32:01 AM 10/30/2000 4:00:03 AM -1 102 0 "Thanks, 
Dottie.  Now I REALLY want to come.

:-)



I thought of the same parallel between the two ultimatums.  
""Merdre!""  and ""Nuts!"" send much the same message.  
Interesting!



 


 


"
53838 11 555 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/09/2000 
10:21:42 AM 10/31/2000 4:00:10 AM -1 87 0 "Have you 
noticed that throughout this book, Hugo is very critical of 
Voltaire? I wonder what that is all about...



The preface of this book made quite a social statement for 
its time:



"" So long as there shall exist, by reason of law and custom, 
a social condemnation, which, in the face of civilisation(sic), 
artificially creates hells on earth, and complicates a destiny 
that is divine, with human fatality; so long as the three 
problems of the age- the degradation of man by poverty, the 
ruin of woman by starvation, and the dwarfing of childhood 
by physical and spiritual night- are not solved, so long as, in 
certain regions, social asphyxia shall be possible; in other 
words, and from a yet more extended point of view, so long 
as ignorance and misery remain on earth, books like this 
cannot be useless.""

                      Hautville House,1862



Beej


"
53839 11 555 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/09/2000 
10:42:47 AM 10/31/2000 4:00:10 AM -1 90 0 "I just finished 
doing some searches on Voltaire. Hugo obviously was quite 
influenced by this powerful giant, but outside of Voltaire's 
views on Deism, I cannot see the purpose of Hugo's rather 
consistent criticism of him. maybe it was ""only"" because 
Voltaire was such a catalyst in the French revolution.

Nonetheless, I am a bit confused.

Dottie, and Kay, can you clarify a bit for me?



Beej


"
53851 11 65 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/09/2000 
11:51:23 AM 10/31/2000 4:00:10 AM -1 79 0 "Beej -- i will 
have to do some investigating before I can respond to the 
Voltaire question -- I had noted his mention of Voltaire and 
others and commentary on philosophies and so forth but 
hadn't picked up on any particular aversion -- just 
background and clarification I felt.  Maybe I'm missing 
something.



Way back there Kay asked about he references to ""the 
lion"" that Hugo made in his Waterloo section -- at the 
battlefield when they built the memorial -- as indicated they 
leveled the area and used the earth to build a high mound 
(the mound at the base of which the rotunda housing the 
panoramic painting was built) and that mound is topped with 
a huge lion -- from the platform around the lion one can look 
out in all directions around the area and see the  
farmhouses and the roads and the memorials built by the 
English and Germans and so on.  I tend to agree with his 
feeling that the battlefield would however have been better 
left in it's natural state so that the terrain relative to the 
battle would still be visible.  As it is -- it's pretty much just flat 
around there.  I am nearing the end of Cosette today.



Dottie

ID is an oxymoron!


"
53853 11 555 0 Les Miserables - Victor Hugo 10/09/2000 
12:07:35 PM 10/31/2000 4:00:10 AM -1 83 0 "Dottie, you're 
sure moving along at a fair clip! Duties around the Connor 
household kept me away from reading much of the 
weekend, so I am only in Book Third, chapter I of Marius. 


I could very well be wrong about Voltaire, bu